The things that broke society
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@DarthVengeant: Your marriage sounds like a painful, frustrating trial for you.
But, it was something I felt trapped in, and that’s not a nice feeling.
I imagine there were a lot of very dark, lonely days in there. I apologize then if what I say seems like I “didn’t get it.” I think I can see it. I think most guys have had at least a phase of frustration in their lives, and if it never went away, it could be a massive, massive amount of pain.
However, I think your problem was with the crazy, not with chastity. Perhaps a not-lunatic could have figured it out with you. Perhaps a not-lunatic could have went to counselling (there are all kinds). We had some big challenges in our marriage. My wife talked me into counselling years ago. We went, both took it seriously and are still together and happy (as often as not :) ). Not saying you didn’t do enough. Not saying you ever could have. I’m simply saying your problem seems to be with the crazy, not with anything that would have been covered up by pre-marriage chastity. If you had married a crazy who was great in bed, you’d still just be Prince Harry. :)
I am going to disagree with you again here. Please understand I am not trying to pick a fight nor is it meant to show any disrespect for your opinion. To the contrary, I find such great conversation awesome especially when folks disagree but can talk about things anyway. This is how people learn new things and if I held no respect for your opinion or thought your points had no value I just would not respond at all.
“God isn’t going to miraculously make you sexually compatible”
This is another lie of the left. I have heard it for years and for a long time believed it myself. We have to understand the left/communists have been trying to reprogram our society not just within the last 25yrs (where they made A LOT of progress) but long before so that you and I as folks not in their 20’s still must not assume everything we knew or were taught by society is correct.
God does make people sexually compatible. If people follow God’s laws then at the point of marriage both folks are virgins, so you pretty much won’t know the difference. And both being people entirely inexperienced with sex get to learn each other together and thereby conform to each others needs. This happens not out of lust but out of love and caring. Now clearly there can still be sexual issues between folks (and that can happen regardless of virginity or not). But marriage is not solely about sex that is simply a benefit of it.
(I am not comparing you to this) The entire leftist trope where somehow a person’s life is quantified by how many orgasms you achieved and how strong they were is just another tall tale they tell so you focus on the self and get lead around by your short term desires. I have seen it all over modern movies and shows where they literally seem to value “making your no-no parts tingly” over all other things. This is a detrimental to humans and society as we can now clearly see in today’s world.
“When you go buy a car do you not test drive it?”
Women are not cars and sex is not a drive. The car does not care about you nor will it change to suit you. And the car you will not have more than a few years. The comparisons are not even close.
“My wife didn’t like sex and it was ALWAYS painful for her, so I really “got none” and it left me frustrated and empty”
OK, so I am going to say some things that might be uncomfortable to hear and hard for me to say. I do apologize in advance I am not judging you, however what I am about to write about myself IS INDEED me judging me.
First off, I am truly sorry that was the case and it worked out in the way it did. I am not going to pick that apart because I know nothing about it and anything I would say directly would be based off little knowledge and that is not right for such a personal situation.
However, I will use myself as an example and tell you how I now judge myself from my experience. I will be as brief and frank as possible.
I was married for several years. It ended badly. I was personally in love and the way and the abruptness with which it ended broke me for several years. I was very angry, highly depressed and life was going sideways fast in all facets due to this. Remember that line from “The Shawshank Redemption”? “You have to get busy living or get busy dying”? Well I had come to that fork in the road. My initial thought was well I could just end it and be done. But I had a young daughter and I knew that was a grave sin and she did not deserve a life wondering why I would leave her. So I choose to start climbing out of the pity hole I had dug for myself because I had a job to do which was raise my daughter. It was a long road full of many failures to come out of that dark place. At the time my ex-wife was awful, soulless and it broke my heart each week when I had to drop my daughter off to her and by that time things had come out where it was my understanding my ex-wife jumped from my bed directly to another and that was most likely going on before hand and a number of other unsavory things followed many of which affected my daughter negatively.
Feel sorry for me yet? Think my ex is a total b!tch who effortlessly harmed me whom is to blame for most if not all of that?
Well don’t. Do not feel sorry for me and while my ex is many negative words I won’t use it does not matter. Why? IT’S MY FAULT. Why? I choose that situation. I put myself in that position. No one forced me to do anything. Yes, I was fooled to some degree as she was playing a part and I was a target but I did have enough information to know better. But I was in love. And this was due in large part because I was relatively inexperienced sexually and when she came at me like a horny spider monkey I chose poorly and got fooled and fell into a great deal of sin. The price I paid for that are the consequences to my actions I explained above.
My prize, so to speak, for going through all that and focusing not on my pain but the success of my daughter is I have had full custody for quite some time now. But overall, had I just done what God intended that situation would not have gone down like that in my opinion. This is not to say following God’s laws makes us free of obstacles we need to overcome but I think it certainly means much less of them. God’s puts stones in our path so we learn how to jump. The stones we trip over that we laid ourselves are just self inflicted pain.
“Poverty is one of the main factors in over-population. It’s the only pleasure some people have. Then you have the welfare cases that have more kids in order to get more money.”
Well people are going to make poor decisions regardless of what you legislate. Morality is taught and learned it cannot be enforced in law. The best solution in my opinion is not to make it so people are free of consequences or legitimizing every desire as good and OK simply because you had it. This is what has been done for decades. Have we solved poverty or “over population” issues yet?
“There needs to be incentive to have no kids, or less of them. Tax cuts, etc. The more kids you have, the more you pay”
The reality is birth rates are plummeting and they have been for quite some time. The world is already depopulating. Has that solved anything? Has anything gotten better?
To me, the weeds that choke society all spring from this attitude: “I shouldn’t have to sacrifice myself.”
Once a man gets married and has kids, he is – at most – the third thing he should think about. He should do both.
Planting trees you’ll never sit in the shade of is how you have a civilization.
When the ordinary thought of a highly cultivated people begins to regard ‘having children’ as a question of pro’s and con’s, the great turning point has come. – Oswald Spengler
Wall of text incoming. Please, do not take my many words to be combative or argumentative. The post is long because you make great points and I am immensely enjoying the conversation.
We will just have to agree to disagree with the sex thing.
The examples you bring up about things not working sometimes are valid. However I believe for the most part those are exceptions to the rule and not the rule. You cannot test a law or a rule for perfection and then try to amend the rule for every exception. If the rule works well for 95% of the people then it is a good one and we do not invalidate it for the 5%.
For example. Green beans are considered healthy to eat. And for the absolute vast majority of folks they are. But surely there are some whom have an allergy to them or maybe they just don’t agree with them so they avoid it. We don’t not invalidate the initial premise simply because it is not true for absolutely everyone.
It’s the same with sex. What is healthy and good is to abstain before marriage and we do not invalidate that premise because they are some whom have more trouble with it than others.
As humans we typically attempt to avoid obstacles vs trying to overcome them. But sometimes these are laid before us by God as something to conquer so that we grow. Just as we consider pain in the gym necessary to grow muscle sometimes pain in life is needed for spiritual and personal growth.
“Yes, my car test drive comparison is valid”” Seriously man. Come on now.”
I was not mocking your comparison I was just trying to point out I thought it to be 2 things so different in levels of complexity that they should not be compared.
” I simply know how it is to be in an unhappy marriage that had very low intimacy, and how that feels.”
As do I. I am not at all trying to invalidate your feelings nor am I saying they are wrong or incorrect. I am not even saying your opinions are wrong. I simply am explaining why I personally disagree.
“The world is not depopulating.”
My mistake for thinking more about the United States or the west when I was talking about population in the world, that’s on me. Parts of the world are growing in population but the west is having such a rapid decline in growth rate that there is fear the economies won’t hold up. Now part of that is because we are top heavy since people are living longer but far less people are being born to replace them.
The topic is actually quite fascinating when you start looking into the numbers because so many factors play into it. And if you take India and China out the equation of growth (those 2 countries alone are nearly half of the world’s population) those numbers change drastically.
But the world growth rate is rapidly falling and the depopulation you crave so much is coming. Many people seem to think depopulation will solve problems but no one thinks about the problems it will cause. And with that being said while I hear people say that we need less people. What actual problems will this solve? I question that because in most cases anything anyone mentions is something that existed prior to our current levels.
“But, we do not live in an ideal world sadly. Sex is nearly meaningless with younger people and pretty much a selfish act now. ”
Agree 100%
“Oddly enough, I do believe things are the way they are now because the morals that god set out for humanity has been destroyed. ”
Again, agree 100%. God’s rules for us are not arbitrary tests created just to see if we follow them. They are rules for a content and healthy life. The Bible is not simply a collection of stories, it is the manual for life.
” However, I question and don’t agree with everything or every part of what the bible says is “right””
It is healthy to question things because if you don’t how can you understand them fully? God never said don’t question me just do as I say, to the contrary the Bible is essentially about explaining why things are this way and why we should follow him. But you don’t get to have it both ways as that is hypocrisy. You cannot say I believe in God a being whom made me and everything around me but I disagree with him here. Things are true or they aren’t. The level of difficulty or discomfort a truth has for us personally does not affect that truth.
“I am not the type to be a blind follower.”
Nor am I. Everything I have spoken about are not points I simply learned and repeated. These are conclusions I have drawn through life. Was I born into the Church? Yes. But I left it all for some time and as a young man believed the lies of the world. It was through experience and thought that I concluded God was there and so was evil and the world very much attempts to drag you in only one of those directions.
And God does not want blind followers. You cannot truly love what you don’t understand. If God had wanted robots he would have made them but instead he made people with self awareness and gave us all free will. But free will does not mean lack of consequences. God is love but he is also holy and righteous.
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